tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8483622.post2257052772874975175..comments2024-02-29T20:00:59.902-08:00Comments on Cartago Delenda Est: They Know That You Can't KnowMatteohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05393908406875742989noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8483622.post-68153740411882091852010-06-29T23:11:10.127-07:002010-06-29T23:11:10.127-07:00"One might also mention that Thomas did not a..."<i>One might also mention that Thomas did not attempt "to prove by logic the possibility of creation 'ex nihilo.'" He actually stated that temporal creation could not be metaphysically proven but must be taken as a tenet of faith.</i>"<br /><br />I don't know enough to know how closely that captures Aquinas' thought. <br /><br />But, I do know that -- due to the dedicated efforts of many persons over many years to muddle the meaning of the word 'faith' -- what you're written will be understood to mean something bearing no relationship to anything Aquinas would ever have said.<br /><br /><br />Further, according to Edward Feser (and I have no reason to doubt him), Aquinas' arguments make no assumptions or commitments whatsoever about whether the universe began to exist.<br /><br />"<i>Aristotle himself believed that the universe was eternal and without beginning. This of course is not the same as to say it is without cause.</i>"<br /><br />Indeed.<br /><br />Let us imagine some world in which there is a song which has never not been sung; the song is “without beginning.” Is the song thereby without cause? Of course not! If there is a song, there is a singing and a singer. The song is continuously caused by the continuous act of the singer in singing the song.<br /><br />To speak of the cause of a thing is a very different act and concept than to speak of the duration of the thing.Ilíonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15339406092961816142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8483622.post-67288018883325222072010-06-29T22:20:07.817-07:002010-06-29T22:20:07.817-07:00One might also mention that Thomas did not attempt...One might also mention that Thomas did not attempt "to prove by logic the possibility of creation 'ex nihilo.'" He actually stated that temporal creation could not be metaphysically proven but must be taken as a tenet of faith. Aristotle himself believed that the universe was eternal and without beginning. This of course is not the same as to say it is without cause. To speak thus would be to render the universe/Big Bang itself the much maligned uncaused cause.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8483622.post-87388339992322439782010-06-29T18:17:36.785-07:002010-06-29T18:17:36.785-07:00I have far more respect for even the typical inter...I have far more respect for even the typical internet atheist (*) that for the typical 'agnostic.'<br /><br /><br />(*) at any rate, until they start trying to redefine atheism as agnosticism.Ilíonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15339406092961816142noreply@blogger.com